Curse

Sekkira · Nov 13, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

it worked like that in the E3 for everyone and WPE. But that was like a 3 day thing.

Removing all gold from everyone is like telling everyone in the world they are now bankrupt and they have to start from scratch.

twicky_kid · Nov 13, 2005, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wraparound

I pretty much agree with all that you've said so far Twicky Kid. Good discussions.

But can you define the term "pro bond"? I heard that before but not sure what that was at on time.

ty

pro bond = protective bond

it was a great and wonderous skill that had many uses. it was nerfed to hell and back after solo monks could farm UW very easily with it. pvp was affected so much by that change. one of the only times pve affected something in pvp. its a great skill that after nerf is now officially a dead skill. you cannot use it in pve or pvp anymore. soon as you enchant someone to protect them you would drain your energy and once that happens pro bond ends.

i would rather be bankcrupt and have prices resonable then see them get out of reach of the majority of players like they are right now. fow armor is more for prestige which is fine, but having to farm for about 5-6 months straight, in current econemy, just to buy it is just rediculous.

d4nowar · Nov 13, 2005, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekkira

it worked like that in the E3 for everyone and WPE. But that was like a 3 day thing.

Removing all gold from everyone is like telling everyone in the world they are now bankrupt and they have to start from scratch.

Yep, in the WPE and most of the BWE, common materials like iron, cloth, and tanned hides (big money maker there) were a huge part of the market. Buy low, sell high. Thats what made the game fun for me in the beginning. Then the economy crashed. Meh. More pvp for me I guess.

aron searle · Nov 13, 2005, 08:37 PM // 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

erase all gold is remove all gold from people accounts we all start over with 0 gold on each character and storage. you keep your assest and items. you can have tons of items but if no one has the gold to buy them then the price would drop like mad.

Could work, but it would be taking the piss if it just happend with no warning.

Quote:

reset the merchant prices with everyone having 0 gold would start the econemy over. its been inflated too much by farming to change quickly. every time there is an update that affects farming in any way people panic and buy everything. that causes prices to up quickly. since there is so much gold out there from farming in the early days people can afford the price increases. we had prices up to 70k for runes and 40k for dies. silver at one time as at 15k. the market still held up even with prices that high. that should tell you how much gold people really have.

I dont agree, in terms of comparison they would still shoot up to silly prices, let me explain

instead of 100k absorb would be 20k

but instead of me having 20k i have 2k so nothing really changes.

(althoug it would be a slower rise to start with like you say but not slooooow slow)

Quote:

party drops were nerfed b/c of farming. if they make a minimum party size to leave town you can no longer solo preventing farming w/o nerfing any skills or making the AI even dumber.

can you prove that please, as i dont remember them ever being any good to start with.

Quote:

they have tried to everything to reset the econemy and battle inflation. i think they have taken the wrong route. instead of making more gold sinks (skills, keys, entrance to fow or uw) they should have erased all gold from the beginning.

but that would only slow it down in "spikes" evertime they take gold away, not really solving the problem.

Quote:

i don't know if its possible to erase all the gold in circulation but if they said that i have to give up my gold to reset merchants price, have minimum party sizes, reduced price of skills, increased drops for full parties, unnerf some skills i would be the first in line.

BINGO, and i would be right behind you.

Quote:

take all my gold i don't care give my pro bond back.

It does need to be changed somewhat though, they just went the wrong way about it.

Being able to stand there surrounded by a mob, and taking no damage whilst not even being at the keyboard, is unbalanced

elementswrath · Nov 13, 2005, 08:39 PM // 20:39

One of the things I see wrong with the economy is its seller to buyer ratio. Go to any town and you will find there are tons more people selling items then buying them. I spent three hours trying sell everything from bow strings to green items with little luck (I was not picky either.) Mabey I dont know what I am talking about but I now sell most of my runes, upgrades and gold and purple items to the general store.

twicky_kid · Nov 13, 2005, 08:39 PM // 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by d4nowar

Yep, in the WPE and most of the BWE, common materials like iron, cloth, and tanned hides (big money maker there) were a huge part of the market. Buy low, sell high. Thats what made the game fun for me in the beginning. Then the economy crashed. Meh. More pvp for me I guess.

i made so much money on material in the beggining on materials. loved when i saw the merchants dip below the player price and people never realized it. dumped about 30k into player trades then took it all the way to the bank at the merchants

even that in a since was a broken econemy b/c people had enough money, like myself, to flip items like that at the merchants for even more gold. the merchant does pump gold into the econemy as well. while the merchants were broken for so long i and plenty of other players took advantage and also flooded more gold into the system along with farmers.

later on i realized that if i kept doing that the price at the merchants would rise and get to a point where the other players wouldn't buy it. players would sell just under merchant and would never sell back to the merchant to reduce the price. if we had all bought from the merchants then sold to players at lower price we could drop the prices. that would req you to lose money so no one does it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elementswrath

One of the things I see wrong with the economy is its seller to buyer ratio. Go to any town and you will find there are tons more people selling items then buying them. I spent three hours trying sell everything from bow strings to green items with little luck (I was not picky either.) Mabey I dont know what I am talking about but I now sell most of my runes, upgrades and gold and purple items to the general store.

use forums. problem with spamming in towns is you are broadcasting it to people with most likely local and trade turned off. i never have trade on. i turn local on long enough to find a pug.

post it on a forum and use as many as you can find. people only go to those forums if they want to buy something. just advertising in the wrong place.

aron searle · Nov 13, 2005, 08:45 PM // 20:45

Quote:

later on i realized that if i kept doing that the price at the merchants would rise and get to a point where the other players wouldn't buy it. players would sell just under merchant and would never sell back to the merchant to reduce the price. if we had all bought from the merchants then sold to players at lower price we could drop the prices. that would req you to lose money so no one does it.

the thing is buying as well as selling.

if i were to buy a black dye i would but from a player for say 6k (he gets5.5 from trader / and 7k to buy from trader).

twicky_kid · Nov 13, 2005, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by aron searle

the thing is buying as well as selling.

if i were to buy a black dye i would but from a player for say 6k (he gets5.5 from trader / and 7k to buy from trader).

it used to be the other way around. buy from players cheap sell to merchants for higher. this is one the things that messed the econemy up while the invisimonk was still running.

i made more money from traders than anywhere. would take me about 2 hours or so to double my storage's gold by using player and merchant trades. for example.

i could sell my hides to merchant at 350g for 10. that's 35g each. while players where selling to each other for about 20g each. that's a 15g profit from each hide. i so spent a few hours in LA and ascalon buying mass quantities of hides from players. after i had about 4k hides in my inventory i sold them all to the merchant. made about a 45k profit on those just for doing nothing more than trading.

stuff like that happened all the time in the early days. i called myself a "flipper" much like the real estate term.

Sekkira · Nov 13, 2005, 09:06 PM // 21:06

I remember specifically cloth being the money maker as for some reason it was rare to get.

Samueldg · Nov 13, 2005, 09:18 PM // 21:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by calamitykell

That's because of the "I can't make 10k in 5 minutes" overreactive panic.

When people take a deep breath and chill out, things should settle out [hopefully].

thats a GROSS exageration...

a 55hp monk doing prophets path griffs and the minos in that area averages between 1k and 1.5k per 8 minute run .... count another 2 min to clear invent and your looking at 1.5k PER 10 minutes...

your 10k is actually about an hour of farming griffs...

the chances of getting ONE gold drop in that hour are about 1 in 6... which means you MAY net one gold in an hour.. more than likely its not going to be max damage either...

its those WHO DONT farm often who think its some "OMG LEETZOR PWN WAY OF PLAT GETTIN!!!!!"

which is BS...

farming actually doesnt average you much more than regular game play .. what id DOES do is allow a person to NOT have to deal with crap talking know-it-all teenagers... and enjoy the game hassle free..

twicky_kid · Nov 13, 2005, 09:22 PM // 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samueldg

thats a GROSS exageration...

a 55hp monk doing prophets path griffs and the minos in that area averages between 1k and 1.5k per 8 minute run .... count another 2 min to clear invent and your looking at 1.5k PER 10 minutes...

your 10k is actually about an hour of farming griffs...

the chances of getting ONE gold drop in that hour are about 1 in 6... which means you MAY net one gold in an hour.. more than likely its not going to be max damage either...

its those WHO DONT farm often who think its some "OMG LEETZOR PWN WAY OF PLAT GETTIN!!!!!"

which is BS...

farming actually doesnt average you much more than regular game play .. what id DOES do is allow a person to NOT have to deal with crap talking know-it-all teenagers... and enjoy the game hassle free..

1 gold on 1 of 6 runs?

i'm still getting at least 1 purple every run and used to get 2-3 golds per run. drops for everyone is different but this increased your chances above anything of getting that godly weapon you want. too bad there is no such thing b/c that godly weapon you want i got in 10 minutes at the collectors.

the game's econemy was somewhat stable when the game first started. before the invinsimonk everyone could afford armor and could usually buy the armor at the next town to further their adventures. go back and work your way through the game now from nothing and you will not be able to afford anything.

i recently got another account. started a new pve character and wanted to do it w/o the help from my other account. after 3 days i had enough materials for my ascalon armor. the drops are so crappy now that new people can't get jack. since you have no money the prices right now are out of your reach. farming has taken away all avenues of money making b/c of drop nerfs. if they drop nerfs never happened my character could have gone through the game w/o having to grind for money to afford new armor.

this is what is wrong with the econemy and there is no way to fix it as long as the farmers exist.

Maiyn · Nov 13, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53

You people are wrong. Farmers bring prices down. Get with it. (duh, how much is ectoplasm now?) People are gouging? I have zealous strings I will sell for 1k, I have a vamp sword 3:1 and I'll sell it for 15k. Am I a rip off machine? No I don't think so >:/

It's bots, and ebay that messes up the economy.

ps- you can farm with ANY character. Necro is pretty fun lately

Omg Kthxbye · Nov 13, 2005, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

the game's econemy was somewhat stable when the game first started. before the invinsimonk everyone could afford armor and could usually buy the armor at the next town to further their adventures. go back and work your way through the game now from nothing and you will not be able to afford anything.

i recently got another account. started a new pve character and wanted to do it w/o the help from my other account. after 3 days i had enough materials for my ascalon armor. the drops are so crappy now that new people can't get jack. since you have no money the prices right now are out of your reach. farming has taken away all avenues of money making b/c of drop nerfs. if they drop nerfs never happened my character could have gone through the game w/o having to grind for money to afford new armor.

this is what is wrong with the econemy and there is no way to fix it as long as the farmers exist.

Look at why this post started. Prices are rising. Why? Because the latest patch made it very hard to farm in the desert. So let's think about this...now there are LESS farmers, and the prices are RISING. Let's reverse the situation...MORE farmers = LOWER prices. What on earth makes you think that farmers make prices rise?

Farmers bring more gold and items into the economy. MORE items means LOWER prices. It's simple economics. Look at the economy after this latest patch for plain and simple proof. There are far less farmers now and prices for everything are skyrocketing. I expect them to keep going up as long as ANet doesn't step in and reset prices or something. The only prices going down are Monk Superior Runes which are in far less demand now that the patch nerfed IMonks.

Farmers HELP the economy. They keep prices down so everyone can afford decent items. The top perfect mods are always going to be super expensive, but hey, is it really worth the extra 80K for a +30hp sword pommel over a +26hp one? I don't think so.

Sekkira · Nov 13, 2005, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Actually I used to see the +30 go for 20k up until recently. Which is a far deal down from the amazingly ridiculous price it used to be.

Fantus · Nov 13, 2005, 10:32 PM // 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

erase all gold, reset prices to base, and create minimum party sizes. there econemy fixed.

If you want to completely destroy the game in a fraction of a second, you could also drop a nuclear bomb into A-Net's Datacenters. Although your idea is almost as good at that and doesn't leave any nuclear waste..

*shakes head*

sonicLife · Nov 13, 2005, 11:20 PM // 23:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

it used to be the other way around. buy from players cheap sell to merchants for higher. this is one the things that messed the econemy up while the invisimonk was still running.

i made more money from traders than anywhere. would take me about 2 hours or so to double my storage's gold by using player and merchant trades. for example.

i could sell my hides to merchant at 350g for 10. that's 35g each. while players where selling to each other for about 20g each. that's a 15g profit from each hide. i so spent a few hours in LA and ascalon buying mass quantities of hides from players. after i had about 4k hides in my inventory i sold them all to the merchant. made about a 45k profit on those just for doing nothing more than trading.

stuff like that happened all the time in the early days. i called myself a "flipper" much like the real estate term.

And yet this is what you said earlier in this thread- "if you see a price gouger call him out in public or trade channel and alert people. if they fell they would be getting ripped off they won't buy it."
I'm confused. Aren't you the one thats ripping the people off?

twicky_kid · Nov 14, 2005, 12:21 AM // 00:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by sonicLife

And yet this is what you said earlier in this thread- "if you see a price gouger call him out in public or trade channel and alert people. if they fell they would be getting ripped off they won't buy it."
I'm confused. Aren't you the one thats ripping the people off?

wasn't ripping people off b/c it was the normal price that players were trading for. this stuff was about 1 month after release. nothing to do with current market.

can't help people didn't check the merchants before they sold. flipping was fixed and will never happen again. still just too much gold in this game pumped by the solo farmers and merchant abusers. the game was released with a weak econemy that the flippers and farmers completely shattered with in 3 months. none of this was part of the plan.

calamitykell · Nov 14, 2005, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omg Kthxbye

Look at why this post started. Prices are rising. Why?

Panic. The end.

yesitsrob · Nov 14, 2005, 01:10 AM // 01:10

Um, minimum party size sounds like quite a reasonable idea to me, it's _supposed_ to be a team game afterall - though i'd expect being allowed to take henchies into the underworld. trips to the underwolrd start off kind of cool then it's like zomg let's red engine kill smites.

There should probably be a cap on the cost of runes, the fact people have to pay 15k or whatever for a suprior smiting rune just because every other monk bought one to get as lower health as possible seems a bit harsh (although i go a superior smiting drop today, so it was good for me I guess

). And 8k black dye is stupid, it's goddamn dye, not a house

they need to sort AI out though before they start making changes if they really want to stop farming... which they say they don't but they sort of do an awful lot to try. emphasis on the word try.

But minumum party size, sure - no doubt that would bring another million and one bitchfests to the message board and more posts saying "i'm quitting guild wars" - and I really wish they would but then these people return to whine about the next patch... yeah but I like the idea, supposed to be a cooperative game right? even if that means cooperating with henchies

Alone) · Nov 14, 2005, 01:18 AM // 01:18

Okay, some alright points, some bad ones, some ones that might work.

The reason why people are now selling items for higher is because It is now harder to get these items, at a fast pace. Meaning that when farming was around, it actually kept the market clearing price at a slowly dropping/rising rate. The more the people farmed, the more the items were available to the community. However, now then more than 60% of the people who used to farm, stopped (in my opinion), items will become now more rare to achieve than before.

Erase all gold? Really now. If you were to work for something really hard, something to save up for, and then lose it all, how would you feel?

So far, prices I feel will raise dramatically. However, that means more people will have less money later on, and therefore stop buying. So prices MIGHT drop down in a few weeks or so.

Only a few days after the update, so we shall see. Eh?